Graphic Designer Victoria O’May
About this episode…
GrAPHic designer & art director victoria o’may
Brazilian creative Victoria was working in advertising in London when in 2013 she fancied a change.
A change of pace, country and language, and to help her do that she figured she’d go freelance in Spain.
After 3 years she took a job in an agency. Four years on she felt ready to freelance again. A pandemic and motherhood making the flexibility of working from home even more appealing.
Second time around Victoria felt much more prepared. In her positioning, her processes, her dealings with clients… in running her own business.
Read the highlights in the next tab.
IT GETS EASIER OVER TIME
Victoria first went freelance in 2013 when she moved to Spain. After 3 years she found a job in an agency, still freelancing a little on the side. After 4 years she went full-time freelance again and this time she was much more on top of things as a business owner…
“I think being freelance, you have to think that you have a business - I see myself as ‘I own a business’, I am my business, let's say.
The second time (I went freelance), it was easier: how I positioned myself, how I spoke to clients, the processes, all got much better. So the results were better as well. And how I now value myself, value the work.
I tried to look at each new client as a new opportunity to expand my portfolio. I was really putting myself into it to better the processes and how I was presenting myself to the client and to the world.”
STRUCTURING YOUR PROCESS
Whatever it is you do, when you’re freelance and being self-motivated, self-led, it really helps to know how you get to your place of creativity - and that can take time to figure out…
“Getting to know your process. I think the more you do something, the better you get at it by understanding how, step by step... The creative process needs some sort of structure, it's not just sitting down there and, you know, getting the ideas.”
GETTING TO KNOW CLIENTS
Victoria finds it exciting when people around the world have connected with her work online and would like to entrust her with designing for their business. She loves to build a relationship with her clients…
“I really enjoy getting to know people. I think you just have to be very empathetic. You have to understand the client…
Usually I set up a Zoom call and we get a first call to get to know each other. I tell them a a little bit about my process and I really like to get to know them a little bit more cuz you get a feel for how the relationship will go. It's just different than back and forth emails, I think. It's not just about how much is the service, it's about understanding what they want and what you can offer. And it is in the end also understanding how can you help and being very clear about it. It's always good to talk..”
KNOWING OTEHR FREELANCERS
As well as in online communities, Victoria has got to know and become friends with freelancers who live near her…
“I think it's important to create a network and have some support because you can get lonely working at home. As much as I enjoy it, sometimes you get in your head too much - it's good to go out and talk to other people and realise that they go through the same thing… It's good to have other freelancers around.”
PREPARE EARLY ON
Victoria would tell her younger freelance self to get organised while she’s not so busy with client work…
“Learn about the business side of things early on and prepare yourself. It's good to get things organised before you start because you're gonna have more free time when you start to get the business set up. Cuz then the work starts coming in, hopefully. And then it's harder to organise these things.”
“Sometimes you get in your head too much...
It's good to go out and talk to other people and realise that they go through the same thing… It's good to have other freelancers around.”"
Graphic Designer Victoria O’May
More from VICTORIA O’MAY
Victoria’s website
Victoria on LinkedIn
More from Steve Folland
Transcript of the Being Freelance podcast with Steve Folland and Graphic Designer & Art Director Victoria O’May:
Steve Folland:
Can't wait to hear how you got started being freelance.
Victoria O'May:
There was a take one and take two. So I'll try to not take too long to explain. I used to work in advertising and I was living in London for a few years. And then I decided I wanted to change and I moved to Spain, to Malaga and then I changed everything and I started being freelance, which didn't work very well at the beginning. So I had to take a step back and, you know, see how I would approach it in a different way. And then I took a job in an agency here in Spain. And then I did my take two, which is where I'm now. And that's how I started being freelance in a very quick way. So at first I wanted to change, I wanted to control my own time and have more freedom.
And I didn't wanna live in a big city, so it felt like freelance could give me that, but I jumped into it unprepared and moving to a new country with a new language. So it was really overwhelming. And then the second time, I was more conservative in my approach. So I had a financial cushion, I had a job and slowly I was doing paid side projects and getting my clients and building a portfolio that would represent where I wanted to be. And then at the end of 2020, I started freelancing full-time and I'm here now.
Steve Folland:
And so how long did that first attempt at freelanicng last?
Victoria O'May:
It was quite long... Three years I think it was.
Steve Folland:
Oh, right. I was getting the impression it was like maybe three months.
Victoria O'May:
No, no. I <laugh>. I think it was three years - I was still finding my feet in Spain and uh, bureaucracy here is a bit crazy, if you wanna start a business; it's a bit better now. But yeah. And then I moved town, and then I found a job in a local agency, which was really good to understand how people, you know, work in different countries in a similar industry. And it gave me good background here as well.
Steve Folland:
So in that first attempt, how did you go about finding your clients?
Victoria O'May:
I had lots of Brazilian clients then, which were contacts from being Brazilian and friends of friends, friends of family. And then I was doing a lot of local networking as well. I was in a co-working space and, you know, I found a lot of people. But I really made things complicated for myself cuz I moved in 2013 and the crisis was still very strong in Spain, especially in the south of Spain. So it was complicated to find the kind of clients I wanted locally.
Steve Folland:
The crisis - as in the financial crisis of 2008 was still going...
Victoria O'May:
Exactlt. That was still strong here at the time. And yeah, especially in the south, it's very reliable on services and tourism and everything. So I was looking for local clients and I had lots of Brazilian clients just out of networking and friends and family, that was pretty much how I found the clients then. It was all right. It wasn't too bad, but it was not... I was not feeling like I was in the right direction. So I took a step back.
Steve Folland:
What was it that felt wrong? Because three years sounds like you managed to kind of get it up and running and were still going.
Victoria O'May:
It's just... I was not getting the type of clients I wanted, like budget wise and I was not focused enough. I think it wasn't the right time for me. So three years was like a long time, but when you moved to a new country, there's just so many things going on. And I was trying to to focus on other other things as well such as illustration. So I think I was a bit like too many things at a time, you know?
Steve Folland:
Yeah. I suppose being freelance can take up a lot of head space. So you found it easier then to go into a full-time role at an agency?
Victoria O'May:
Definitely.
Steve Folland:
And how long did you spend there?
Victoria O'May:
Four years.
Steve Folland:
And did you learn anything from your time in that agency that you then took into your second attempt at freelancing?
Victoria O'May:
Oh yeah, definitely. I learned from my time in advertising and then in that agency. Like getting to know your process. I think the more you do something, the better you get at it by understanding how, you know, step by step... The creative process needs some sort of structure, it's not just sitting down there and, you know, getting the ideas. So yeah I think structuring my process and learning from other people as well. And I think the world has changed so much since the first time I attempted being freelance and the second time, so that also plays a big part in it. I'd learned in the job and also the world around me and the internet, everything changed so much.
Steve Folland:
Yeah. So when you then went freelance the second time, how did you get your clients? How did you go about getting the higher paying clients or the clients doing the work that you wanted to?
Victoria O'May:
Yeah, well then I was looking at networking more online. So there was still lots of referrals from people that I knew - like I started working with a couple of clients and you get referrals and then you get referrals that's how I'm getting the work now. But yeah, online - networking, making connections in social media and being in different groups and also job boards, you know, looking for opportunities and seeing who was looking for freelance design projects.
Steve Folland:
What kind of online networking did you find worked really well for you?
Victoria O'May:
Facebook groups, surprisingly, just commenting and going in and trying to be present and share your ideas with people. There's some Slack groups as well, they're helpful. So there's not one place - I feel there's lots of different places. Just trying to be in different places and things will start coming your way, especially if you have a portfolio and people connect with your work. And then usually if this happens, the relationship between clients and the designer is a good one.
Steve Folland:
And where are your clients now? Because originally a lot of them were in Brazil.
Victoria O'May:
Now they're not actually. They were in the past, and I love working in Brazilians. But now they're mostly in the United States. I was surprised when that start happening.
Steve Folland:
What kind of projects do you work on? Is it something that might last months and months or very short things? Do you have things running side by side, like multiple projects at once? What's it look like for you?
Victoria O'May:
Uh, it's a bit of everything. I do project based, it could be as long as two months. It could be something quicker. But usually I do a lot of brand identity, so that takes some time and it takes a lot of previous time to get to know the client, really understanding. So it's a very intimate relationship cuz you have to learn a lot about the client and the plans and the dreams and the businesses. So that can take, you know, two months or longer, especially if you're going to do web design. So I might be working with a client for a year and that's one project depending on what they have and their timings as well. And then I have a retainer client as well, so we work monthly together. We have different projects and work on different things. And so it is a bit of a mixture.
Steve Folland:
How do you manage to stay organised when you've got all those things going on at once?
Victoria O'May:
Oh, yes. Um, <laugh>, I had to learn. I try not to take too many clients at the same time, so I need a buffer between projects so I can move from one to another and not be overwhelmed. Cuz I think what we do is creative, so you do brain space to work. You know, we cannot have like a bunch of projects going on at the same time. So I thank Google Calendar and Trello <laugh>, so my second brain is in there and, and I put notes, to-do lists and just block my calendar for the important projects and important dates that I need to be available. So Trello and Google calendar are really helpful for me.
Steve Folland:
And do you have a niche, be it in terms of design or in terms of industry or more general?
Victoria O'May:
Hmm. I think I'm more general. To be honest, I have been thinking about, oh, everyone says niche down niche down and I understand that, but I never did. And I think, now I can niche down by service. So I do a lot of brand identity. I do book covers, but sometimes these brand identities, you know, they become websites or they become packaging and then depending on the project, if it's something that's beyond my skills, I will collaborate with a different freelancer or different professional to do the copy or to do development or SEO depending on each client's needs. But yeah, I think mainly now I do a lot of brand identity and book covers. And I have a very clean style. I try not to decorate the work too much and I hear that from clients, so I think there is something about the work that speaks to the clients more than the niching, more than the industry or the type of service. That's what I hope to think. <laugh>
Steve Folland:
When you say you collaborate with others or have done - is that where you've hired them?
Victoria O'May:
Well, no, it's more like I put them in touch with the client. So we did the project together, you know, and rather than me hiring. I'm looking at getting help now, but internally so I can free up my time a little bit with things that maybe someone else could be doing. But that would be like something more internal. I'll be client facing. And then if we need a developer, then I think most freelancers do enjoy talking to the clients and the clients like to know who they're talking to, who's doing the work. So that's how I usually work.
Steve Folland:
And how have you found the business side of being freelance?
Victoria O'May:
Yeah, that took me a while to get my head around it. I must say now there's so much information online about being freelance, you know, I mean, you have a course, don't you, <laugh>, so there is just so many resources that you can find and learn. That's so helpful. I think the first time I went freelance, that was a while back - it wasn't like that. And I think the world wasn't like that. So now I did some courses just to get my head around, especially the financial side. Now I have my Excel sheets, you know, I track my income. I have an invoice system that I use. And I have someone that does taxes for me.
And we have quite a lot of paperwork to do here in Spain. So this is the first thing I did, I just want someone to help me with that side of things. Like the more paperwork side of things. Yeah. So I do use my Excel sheets to organise the income and then the invoices and everything is written down in the same place. And I have a projection of how much my earnings will be for the year and I should be focusing more time on marketing, but I'm not, so that's something I wanna look into 2023 to see if I can, you know, just dedicate a little bit more time to marketing, that's so important. But yeah, it's just sometimes you get wrapped up in the routine and the work and, and it becomes hard.
Steve Folland:
Yeah. So you moved to Spain, you wanted to sort of live more rurally, was it? Not necessarily in a city?
Victoria O'May:
No, no, not in a big city like London or Sao Paulo where I was living before.
Steve Folland:
Oh - Yeah, like two of the biggest cities
Victoria O'May:
<laugh>. Yeah. It's not too difficult to go smaller than that. So yeah, I was just looking for a different way of life. It's just slower. I just needed to slow down and I was not so keen to be working 40 something hours a week and the commuting and everything so expensive. And it's just, it just felt like a never ending race, you know? And then I, I had the opportunity to move to Malaga, with some sort of comfort and a nice situation. And I did. So I thought, okay, I'll give it a go. And I like moving around <laugh>, you know, it was an opportunity to live in a new country, learn a different language.
Steve Folland:
Because it's part of what I'm wondering about whether you feel like you've found that work life balance that you were looking for when you made the move?
Victoria O'May:
Yeah, I definitely did. I mean, it was hard at the beginning because everything was new but now after so many years... it's just really nice to be able to walk mostly everywhere. I save so much time and I can work from my home with clients all over the world. And that for me is just perfect balance. Not perfect balance. Cause that doesn't exist, but it's a really good balance, equilibrium between life and work and routine.
Steve Folland:
And at some point on Instagram I remember you sharing that'd you'd had a baby...
Victoria O'May:
Yes, yes. She's not a baby anymore, but...
Steve Folland:
<laugh>. Yeah, I was gonna say, was that before your second attempt at freelancing?
Victoria O'May:
Uh, yes. She was born in 2019. She's three now. And I think the pandemic and motherhood pushed me to jump into freelancing full-time because I have been doing it on the sidelines for quite a while. And that gave me the freedom to push up my prices and choose my clients. But then once I had to go back to work full-time during the pandemic with a small baby, that was just like, okay, this is not what I wanna do. I don't wanna, you know, leave her in the kindergarten or nursery at 9 AM and pick her up at 5 PM or whatever time it is every day, you know? And she's so small. So I decided I needed to be in control of my time to be able to spend more time with my daughter and just, you know, just be more in control of what I do each day and the timings. And I think freelance is not ideal for everyone, but it is just so flexible. So yeah. That little human being <laugh> made a huge part in on pushing me into ging freelance full-time.
Steve Folland:
And how, how did you find working around having a kid - getting the work done, but also the most demanding client screaming at you.
Victoria O'May:
Yeah, yeah. "I'm sick, I have fever." They don't care. They just wanna play <laugh>, you know, they don't respect that. Uh, I'm very thankful to nursery and the people that look after my child while I'm working. With her at home, it's very hard to work. She's three, she's very.. she's an intense child. She's very active and she just won't let me work again. <laugh>. So, yeah, while she's at home, I don't try to work much cuz I know it's gonna be hard unless her dad is here and they're playing. But I try to focus my strong working hours while she's in nursery. And then while she's not, I just do other stuff. I stay with her and do life outside of work. But it was hard in the beginning to find my feet. But having help, it's so important cuz otherwise I couldn't find the time, the hours, to do actual work.
Steve Folland:
Yeah. Do you work like a Monday to Friday type thing or?
Victoria O'May:
Yes, yes, I do. Monday to Friday. I don't work full-time. I mean, it is full-time cause it's all I do, but I don't work all eight hours a day. But it is usually Monday to Friday. I try to keep weekends free. Sometimes I have to do a few things, but if I have to work on a really cool project on the weekend for a few hours, I'm not that bothered because I really enjoy what I do. But I try to keep the space for my family and for my friends and just having some off time, I find it super important to have this sort of flow between one thing and another.
Steve Folland:
And as well as that, you know, client, work, family. Do you do side projects as well?
Victoria O'May:
Hmm. I want to <laugh>, but I don't have the time right now to be honest, to do much side projects. But I do have my artwork, my prints and I do sometimes embroidery on paper and I do have my art practise, but it is paused or on a very slow burn right now cuz it's just a time of my life that... it's not the season, you know? So I'm just waiting until I have a bit more free time to be able to get back to it cuz it's something I really enjoy and it feeds my design work and I feel my design work feeds these as well. So it is a really nice conversation between the two practises. But right now it had to take a back seat cuz there is just so much going on in the other parts of my life.
Steve Folland:
Yeah. You have some amazing prints - you have a shop on your website, right?
Victoria O'May:
I do, yeah, I have a shop. So a lot of the work I have now I created while I was pregnant and I was feeling so creative and then there is some new work that I have here ready to be in the shop, but I need to sit down and upload everything. But yeah, it's hard - it's hard to keep producing nonstop right now.
Steve Folland:
Yeah - that sounds sensible. Something's gotta give. And how do you find dealing with clients?
Victoria O'May:
I really enjoy it - I like getting to know people and feeling like I'm doing something that's gonna, you know, in some cases change their lives cuz they can leave their full-time jobs and get started on their own small businesses and that will grow. So yeah, I really enjoy getting to know people and I find it very exciting when someone reaches out from the internet and they live on the other side of the world and they connected with your work and they want you to help them with something that's usually really important for them. So I really enjoy it and I feel honoured to be able to help people in such a direct way. Some clients are easier to work with than others, but mostly - touch wood, I've been lucky so far, most of my clients have been really easy to work with and I think you just have to be very empathetic. I think being a designer, there is a lot of empathy there. You have to understand the client and then who is the client's client. So there is a whole story there.
Steve Folland:
It sounds like you get to know them. Do you speak to them on a zoom call or whatever it might be?
Victoria O'May:
Yeah, usually I set up a Zoom call and we get a first call to get to know each othe. I tell them a a little bit about my process and I really like to get to know them a little bit more cuz you get a feel for how the relationship will go. It's just different than back and forth emails, I think. It's not just about how much is the service, it's about understanding what they want and what you can offer. And it is in the end also understanding how can you help and being very clear about it. So yeah, I always try to get a Zoom call and see them, get to know them. Some people are very shy and I don't mind keeping on email or doing like, just just voice, which is fine, but most people don't mind. So yeah, I'm flexible in that way, but it's always good to talk.
Steve Folland:
Nice. Yeah. But when you first went freelance, you mentioned going into a cowork space. Do you know many other freelancers?
Victoria O'May:
Yeah, I do. I have a few local freelance colleagues here. I'm now part of the board of the design association where I live. We get together and we have conversations about how to work and how we find clients, best practise, good design practise from the client side, from the designer side. So there's lots of things. So that's a good way of, you know, meeting other freelancers and also online on those communities. I think it's important to create a network and, and have some support cuz you can get lonely working at home. As much as I enjoy sometimes... you get in your head too much, you know, and it's good to go out and talk to other people and realise that they go through the same thing. So I have a friend, she's a translator and she's been doing it for ages and always when I get nervous or I get upset about something or I just call her <laugh>, you know, and she helps me sometimes just, you know, it's a long marathon, so yeah - It's good to have other freelancers around.
Steve Folland:
Oh, that's a lovely thing to have. Yeah. Rather than sitting there letting it eat yourself up.
Victoria O'May:
Exactly. Yeah. So it's just good to share because it's an interesting path. I think being freelance, you have to think that you have a business, you know, I see myself as I own a business, I am my business, let's say, but it's always good to to know that you're not alone on the path you chose. There's lots of people going through the same things. Yeah.
Steve Folland:
So in that period where you are working in the agency, but you are taking on, you know, side projects, you're doing little bits of freelance work here and there, building up a buffer of cash. How did you get that work to be the sort of work that you wanted it to be? Because when you first went freelance, you weren't getting the sort of clients that you really wanted to get is what you said, and yet second time around you have. So maybe there was this period in between when you were working on the side where you figured it out.
Victoria O'May:
I mean, when I first went freelancing, it's not that I had bad clients - they were really nice projects and I was enjoying it. It's just, I think it was more about the way I approached freelancing, you know, how I valued my work and how ready I was. I do think I jumped in too soon. I think that can happen to some people. So I just think I jumped in too soon, not having enough experience as a freelancer and as a business owner as well. I think the business side of things also let me down. I let myself down <laugh> with the business side of things. The way I approached freelancing the first time - I wasn't quite ready. I wasn't quite there yet and not so much the work I was doing, but how I was approaching it, you know, and that was mostly on me to be honest.
And then the second time, learning from that, it was easier: how I positioned myself, how I spoke to clients, the processes - the work process got much better. So the results were better as well. And how I now value myself, value the work. I think it was more about that, not so much the work itself. I tried to look at each new client as a new opportunity to expand my portfolio. I was really putting myself into it to better the processes and how I was presenting myself to the client and, and to the world.
Steve Folland:
Now, Victoria, if you could tell your younger self one thing about being freelance, what would that be?
Victoria O'May:
I think I would say just value your work and what you can offer to your clients. Just make sure you value that. And learn about the business side of things early on and prepare yourself. Just understanding, you know, how it works and I think that gives you clarity and just the easier way to get started. You know, it's good to get things organised before you start cuz you're gonna have more free time when you start to get the business set up. Cuz then the work starts coming in, hopefully. And then it's harder to organise these things.
And work with goals. I think that's really important. So finding your goals and also make projections of how much you wanna earn and where this money is gonna come from. So just be organising that way too.
Steve Folland:
So you're someone who has goals then?
Victoria O'May:
Yeah. I put financial goals and things. <laugh>. Yeah, I try to set up a few goals that when, you know, each year, like not too many, but important ones and nice to have ones, just so I think it keeps you going and it's easier to lose track of, you know... what do you really want when you're busy with all the life things and work things. So I like to write down my goals and just every now and then refer back to them to see if I'm on track. And if I wanna change ideas in the middle of the way, that's fine, but just that to be a conscious decision.
Steve Folland:
Oh, Victoria, it's been such a joy chatting to you. Thank you so much. All the best being freelance!
Victoria O'May:
Thank you, Steve.